Russbo,
You only have to destroy the stations belonging to the race that owns the sector, sometimes there will be a boron station in a pirate sector etc. so you no longer have to destroy the property of someone you are not waging war on.
In theory if you set the race you are attacking to 'foe' (which you have to do to claim the sector) then I guess all their stations turn red and those will be the ones you have to take out. Another way to find out is to land at the station and listen to the docking message to reveal the race.
The raiding parties option works for you?
I need to tweak the beta's factory tax setting because at the moment it gives you too much money, so you may want to hold off a little while, I intend to upload the changes by 8pm tonight GMT at the latest.
Well good luck.
---EDIT---
You've made a very good point, I will have to create a script that identifies which station(s) in a sector belongs to the owner race and adds that report to the message log.
Most of the stations will respawn, and then you'll be getting paid for them.
[SCRIPT] Sector Takeover v2.4.3 [Updated 20-Apr-2007]
Moderators: Moderators for English X Forum, Scripting / Modding Moderators
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russbo
- Posts: 862
- Joined: Sat, 12. Nov 05, 21:53
In Pirate sectors it's easy to see what belongs to whom. But, for example, in Split sectors, I'm not savvy enough about the game to know if there might be non-Split stations in their sectors. Haven't found any; then again, I spend most of my time in those sectors destroying things.
Not to belabor a point, but, I'm assuming that the respawning issue has not gone away, and that enemy Trading stations will respawn (and thus, take the sector back from you? Or pay you taxes?) Anyone figure that one out yet?
Not to belabor a point, but, I'm assuming that the respawning issue has not gone away, and that enemy Trading stations will respawn (and thus, take the sector back from you? Or pay you taxes?) Anyone figure that one out yet?
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nirwin
- Posts: 2879
- Joined: Tue, 1. Nov 05, 23:07
No you are correct, distinguishing which station belongs to whom can be tricky so I will add something to make that task easier.russbo wrote:In Pirate sectors it's easy to see what belongs to whom. But, for example, in Split sectors, I'm not savvy enough about the game to know if there might be non-Split stations in their sectors. Haven't found any; then again, I spend most of my time in those sectors destroying things.
Not to belabor a point, but, I'm assuming that the respawning issue has not gone away, and that enemy Trading stations will respawn (and thus, take the sector back from you? Or pay you taxes?) Anyone figure that one out yet?
Nope, the respawning issue is still there, it's pretty much 2nd or 3rd on my to-do-list. But I have a save just before a pirate base respawns in my game, so I will investigate by watching that sector closely and see if a TL turns up in sector when it respawns. If there is a TL involved then I will not stop it from happening, if there isn't I will do everything I can to prevent it.
If a factory respawns in your sector it should not set the sector ownership back to the original owner. that should only happen if your trading station gets destroyed. The respawning stations will however pay you tax.
---EDIT---
Right there's the update everyone, a little later than planned but I was desperately trying to get the player stations tax working. Sadly I encountered a serious problem with it that I am so far unable to rectify.
Anyway this version now has what I hope will be the final taxing system for the AI. 3,125 credits an hour rent (I think).
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DesertEagle
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Thu, 2. Feb 06, 05:32
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russbo
- Posts: 862
- Joined: Sat, 12. Nov 05, 21:53
Nirwin, I finally figured out something that's been staring me in the face for hours. It's actually pretty easy to see what station belongs to whom. In the sector map, the station identifier code starts with the first letter of their race. So, figuring out what station belongs to what race, is kind of easy.
Problem is, if you want to capture a sector that belongs to someone other than pirates, I'm finding, especially with the Split, whom I've found ways to really piss off, that all of the stations in their sectors belong to them. Therefore, according to the current way this script works, if one wanted to start taking over other non-pirate sectors, one would virtually have to destroy everything.
Granted, the trading stations and equipment docks return (if initially present, and, supposedly now, will pay you a tax). But, will the other stations come back also, thus making this capture bit a profitable venture? I have not experienced that. If not, or there is isn't another way to capture a sector without destroying the "enemy" stations, doing so will eventually end in a futile, expensive and very unprofitable destruction of the sectors and economy.
Just some thoughts.
Problem is, if you want to capture a sector that belongs to someone other than pirates, I'm finding, especially with the Split, whom I've found ways to really piss off, that all of the stations in their sectors belong to them. Therefore, according to the current way this script works, if one wanted to start taking over other non-pirate sectors, one would virtually have to destroy everything.
Granted, the trading stations and equipment docks return (if initially present, and, supposedly now, will pay you a tax). But, will the other stations come back also, thus making this capture bit a profitable venture? I have not experienced that. If not, or there is isn't another way to capture a sector without destroying the "enemy" stations, doing so will eventually end in a futile, expensive and very unprofitable destruction of the sectors and economy.
Just some thoughts.
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nirwin
- Posts: 2879
- Joined: Tue, 1. Nov 05, 23:07
russbo,
bendyspex wrote on page 1:
I do aim to implement a method of capturing stations so that you can profit more from taking over sectors, however, as there are still some fairly major problems with the core script you can understand that it will be a while until I get round to it.
The good news is that I am taking the day off on Monday and I intend to spend the whole day on the SectorTakeover project, so hopefully I can resolve some of the more major issues.
That's good news on being able to identify a stations race, I noticed the same thing with a ships ID code, but never thought of the same principle applying to a stations code. Well that's one less thing to worry about.
bendyspex wrote on page 1:
I doubt that the normal factories you destroy will necessarily respawn where they were, but I'd bet my last penny that the GOD engine replaces them somewhere. However using the above mentioned scripts (especially AL Competitors) in conjunction with this one MIGHT make it a more profitable venture.Good one guys, glad to see this script is really getting going again. This would work really well with the Terracorp script, and the AL Competitors script, since they both build factories in random places, and I have a few in my sectors.
Good work Smile
I do aim to implement a method of capturing stations so that you can profit more from taking over sectors, however, as there are still some fairly major problems with the core script you can understand that it will be a while until I get round to it.
The good news is that I am taking the day off on Monday and I intend to spend the whole day on the SectorTakeover project, so hopefully I can resolve some of the more major issues.
That's good news on being able to identify a stations race, I noticed the same thing with a ships ID code, but never thought of the same principle applying to a stations code. Well that's one less thing to worry about.
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BinkyRider
- Posts: 35
- Joined: Wed, 7. Jun 06, 17:10
@nirwin
If you can't stop the respawning of original race Trading stations and ship yards, could you have a script that checks for this in player owned sectors, every few minutes would be often enough, that spawns an Xenon or Khaak M2 with orders to attack the station then jump out to a very remote location and destroy itself?
As I undersand it the sector is yours so long as your trading station exists so this wouldn't interfere if you lost the sector (only problem might be if the M2 took out stations close to the original race original race Trading stations or ship yard).
Not the best way to handle the issue but perhaps a second best work around.
P.S. I'm not far enough along to have tried this script/mod yet but look forwrd to trying it later, many thanks.
If you can't stop the respawning of original race Trading stations and ship yards, could you have a script that checks for this in player owned sectors, every few minutes would be often enough, that spawns an Xenon or Khaak M2 with orders to attack the station then jump out to a very remote location and destroy itself?
As I undersand it the sector is yours so long as your trading station exists so this wouldn't interfere if you lost the sector (only problem might be if the M2 took out stations close to the original race original race Trading stations or ship yard).
Not the best way to handle the issue but perhaps a second best work around.
P.S. I'm not far enough along to have tried this script/mod yet but look forwrd to trying it later, many thanks.
To learn the uttermost secrets of time and space take one shovel and one wheel barrow and go to the stables.
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nirwin
- Posts: 2879
- Joined: Tue, 1. Nov 05, 23:07
If the worst comes to the worst, I could always check for stations of the original sector owner and if there are any destroy them without an explosion, and this could be done from within the main script (for less overhead) which runs every 500 milliseconds, so you would never even notice it was there, however I hope to come up with something more elegant.BinkyRider wrote:@nirwin
If you can't stop the respawning of original race Trading stations and ship yards, could you have a script that checks for this in player owned sectors, every few minutes would be often enough, that spawns an Xenon or Khaak M2 with orders to attack the station then jump out to a very remote location and destroy itself?
Glad you are interested in the script, we will try to improve it's state by the time you get started with it.
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nirwin
- Posts: 2879
- Joined: Tue, 1. Nov 05, 23:07
Everyone I have posted a BETA of the new version 2.1.
This release will include the taxing of player-owned stations in other races' sectors.
The tax rate is exactly the same for the player as it is for the other races. NOTE: complexes will be charged per individual factory.
If the player does not have enough money to pay a stations tax, that station is claimed by the owner of it's sector.
I also fixed a bug that meant the tax system could not be desabled in the 'AL menu'.
Please test it out and feel free to give back any feedback. I may have left some debug messages in that will put something in the logbook, if you spot one do let me know in case I miss it. I'd particularly like people to test two boundary conditions, thay are:
if the script still works right when the players account has reached its maximum
and if it still works right when the player account is around 0.
I have done testing and BELIEVE these boundary conditions no longer have any negative effects (if that was even this scripts fault) but I can't be sure so it would be nice to have confirmation.
This release will include the taxing of player-owned stations in other races' sectors.
The tax rate is exactly the same for the player as it is for the other races. NOTE: complexes will be charged per individual factory.
If the player does not have enough money to pay a stations tax, that station is claimed by the owner of it's sector.
I also fixed a bug that meant the tax system could not be desabled in the 'AL menu'.
Please test it out and feel free to give back any feedback. I may have left some debug messages in that will put something in the logbook, if you spot one do let me know in case I miss it. I'd particularly like people to test two boundary conditions, thay are:
if the script still works right when the players account has reached its maximum
and if it still works right when the player account is around 0.
I have done testing and BELIEVE these boundary conditions no longer have any negative effects (if that was even this scripts fault) but I can't be sure so it would be nice to have confirmation.
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Alzara
- Posts: 86
- Joined: Tue, 27. Dec 05, 18:47
Idea...
Just an idea, but it could be quite cool if you could somehow allow a player to change the name of a sector he conquers, or maybe even edit the galaxy entry to describe the system under his/her rule.
No idea how it would be done... I just think its an interesting idea
Any thoughts?
Al
No idea how it would be done... I just think its an interesting idea
Any thoughts?
Al
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Saint-Ashley
- Posts: 1267
- Joined: Sat, 3. Dec 05, 03:40
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russbo
- Posts: 862
- Joined: Sat, 12. Nov 05, 21:53
Nriwin, I think being able to change the sector name is good, though, not sure how it will work in the maps and other areas of the game. As for this taxation of stations issue, now we'll have to pay taxes for all of our currently owned stations, regardless of where they live?
Starting to get closer to real life here.... lol
Starting to get closer to real life here.... lol
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DesertEagle
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Thu, 2. Feb 06, 05:32
What about the audio names? These are not going to be read correctly if the player renames a sector... I am against the idea without making a little more work for the player; I would want the player to reach a certain "propaganda level" in a sector before he captures the hearts and minds of the populous enough to be able to rename it.
1) Specifically, I want to put X3's dynamic news stories to work in a "propaganda war" of the player's direction. Propaganda issued by the player would impact race relations with neutral races, potentially giving them a more favorable impression of the player, and making them less likely to side with a hostile race in all out attacks on the player's sectors. Possibly, it could also result in a lessening or waiving of the 'tax' on the player's stations in a particular sector.
Propaganda might work via the player designating (and paying) propagandists to fly to different sectors. The selection of propaganda itself would entail essentially a multiple choice minigame... the result would be highly entertaining bits of semi-random dynamic news sent to tradestations within 2-3 sectors of each propagandist. Enemy races would issue counterpropaganda, and would hire their own propagandists. Part of the strategy of taking over a sector would involve finding and undermining enemy propagandists, and spreading Player-favorable propaganda. Atrocities (killing of neutrals in a sector) would hurt a player's propaganda rating. What do you think?
2) Also:
I think the current sector takeover model is unrealistic in terms of its depictions of the enemy's use of force. I want the enemy races to collect taxes on stations in their sectors. My assumption would be that groups of three to four sectors would be unified (i.e., races would not be entirely monolithic). These sectors would produce their own defense forces, which would mass on the borders of hostile sectors which had a high concentration of hostile ships in them. Defense would work like a more detailed race response script... I'll elaborate more on the algorithms later, just wanted to get this out. Also, it seems to me the enemy would take proactive steps to ensure that future player invasion fleets would be crippled... e.g. cutting supply lines, deploying large numbers of mines and laser towers at 'choke points,' feinting with disposable ships before attacking en masse on high value targets, etc. The advantage of developing a good bottom up approach to attack / defense ai would be that it could then be applied to non-player versus non-player race wars with relatively little penalty.
DesertEagle
1) Specifically, I want to put X3's dynamic news stories to work in a "propaganda war" of the player's direction. Propaganda issued by the player would impact race relations with neutral races, potentially giving them a more favorable impression of the player, and making them less likely to side with a hostile race in all out attacks on the player's sectors. Possibly, it could also result in a lessening or waiving of the 'tax' on the player's stations in a particular sector.
Propaganda might work via the player designating (and paying) propagandists to fly to different sectors. The selection of propaganda itself would entail essentially a multiple choice minigame... the result would be highly entertaining bits of semi-random dynamic news sent to tradestations within 2-3 sectors of each propagandist. Enemy races would issue counterpropaganda, and would hire their own propagandists. Part of the strategy of taking over a sector would involve finding and undermining enemy propagandists, and spreading Player-favorable propaganda. Atrocities (killing of neutrals in a sector) would hurt a player's propaganda rating. What do you think?
2) Also:
I think the current sector takeover model is unrealistic in terms of its depictions of the enemy's use of force. I want the enemy races to collect taxes on stations in their sectors. My assumption would be that groups of three to four sectors would be unified (i.e., races would not be entirely monolithic). These sectors would produce their own defense forces, which would mass on the borders of hostile sectors which had a high concentration of hostile ships in them. Defense would work like a more detailed race response script... I'll elaborate more on the algorithms later, just wanted to get this out. Also, it seems to me the enemy would take proactive steps to ensure that future player invasion fleets would be crippled... e.g. cutting supply lines, deploying large numbers of mines and laser towers at 'choke points,' feinting with disposable ships before attacking en masse on high value targets, etc. The advantage of developing a good bottom up approach to attack / defense ai would be that it could then be applied to non-player versus non-player race wars with relatively little penalty.
DesertEagle
Match Speed of Target:
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143740
Sector Takeover: http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143524
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143740
Sector Takeover: http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143524
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nirwin
- Posts: 2879
- Joined: Tue, 1. Nov 05, 23:07
Those are all reasons that I didn't want to implement sector renaming, the idea of the computer not being able to say the sector name makes me quite against it. But regardless I think we can all agree that something as minor as renaming sectors is quite low on the list of priorities, so it can be ignored for a while.
I think it is important that this script does not get out of control, remember that different scripts can be used together and I think this script needs to focus on what needs to be done to be able to take on the universe and claim sectors. Now nice little touches such as BBS news items about sectors changing hands and even the Propaganda stuff is good and appropriate. But some other things like an advanced race response fleet script and station capturing scripts are really a bit outside the domain of sector takeover, wouldn't it be better if such scripts were made seperately and players could just download the scripts they want.
It just seems odd to me for us to remake the Race Response scripts and try to surpass LV, his script is pretty good and took him a fair amount of time, maybe it would be better to ask him to implement a more defensive AI incl getting them to set up LaserTower defenses at gates etc?
Anyway just my thoughts
@russbo, yes your stations will be taxed where ever they are, unless they are in a sector you own, this I think adds a nice new level to the gameplay, not only do you have to consider where is a good place for a station, you also have to do your best to put it in one of your sectors. It also means a factory that is not selling any goods is now a liability.
I think it is important that this script does not get out of control, remember that different scripts can be used together and I think this script needs to focus on what needs to be done to be able to take on the universe and claim sectors. Now nice little touches such as BBS news items about sectors changing hands and even the Propaganda stuff is good and appropriate. But some other things like an advanced race response fleet script and station capturing scripts are really a bit outside the domain of sector takeover, wouldn't it be better if such scripts were made seperately and players could just download the scripts they want.
It just seems odd to me for us to remake the Race Response scripts and try to surpass LV, his script is pretty good and took him a fair amount of time, maybe it would be better to ask him to implement a more defensive AI incl getting them to set up LaserTower defenses at gates etc?
Anyway just my thoughts
@russbo, yes your stations will be taxed where ever they are, unless they are in a sector you own, this I think adds a nice new level to the gameplay, not only do you have to consider where is a good place for a station, you also have to do your best to put it in one of your sectors. It also means a factory that is not selling any goods is now a liability.
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DesertEagle
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Thu, 2. Feb 06, 05:32
Hi there,
I agree -- sector takeover should not get out of control. I'll concentrate on bug fixes for now. In future, we can build 'modules' that are compatible.
in terms of race response, no fault to LV -- his script is designed for an X3 universe that may or may not have sector takeover in it. Maybe we can convince him to build something that is ST specific... that would be great.
Cheers,
DE
I agree -- sector takeover should not get out of control. I'll concentrate on bug fixes for now. In future, we can build 'modules' that are compatible.
in terms of race response, no fault to LV -- his script is designed for an X3 universe that may or may not have sector takeover in it. Maybe we can convince him to build something that is ST specific... that would be great.
Cheers,
DE
Match Speed of Target:
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143740
Sector Takeover: http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143524
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143740
Sector Takeover: http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143524
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nirwin
- Posts: 2879
- Joined: Tue, 1. Nov 05, 23:07
Excellent, I like your compatible modules idea. I'm just of the opinion that over complication breeds bugs, but that's a good suggestion, almost 'add-ons' for ST (what un unfortunate abbreviation), we could even link to them from this thread or simply post them on this thread.DesertEagle wrote:Hi there,
I agree -- sector takeover should not get out of control. I'll concentrate on bug fixes for now. In future, we can build 'modules' that are compatible.
in terms of race response, no fault to LV -- his script is designed for an X3 universe that may or may not have sector takeover in it. Maybe we can convince him to build something that is ST specific... that would be great.
Cheers,
DE
Ok, I am not sure what the drawbacks are to RRF when ST is involved (cause I never get a chance to actually play the game) but perhaps if LV does not want to make the changes we need, he might let us 'branch' off his script to suit our needs and we could tailor it to ST. We can keep the possibility in mind for when all the necessary bug-fixing is done. Sound good?
By the way, you mentioned you had your debugging library finished, does anything need to go into the scripts? If so do you want to send me them and I'll merge the changes in or is it a completely seperate entity?.
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DesertEagle
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Thu, 2. Feb 06, 05:32
I was wondering how we could work that... The files for debugging are here:
http://www.travisgood.com/X3/GlobalQ.zip
The topic discussion is here:
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=144118
It hasn't exactly lit the world on fire
Primarily they are for us. So... if you get a chance, download the file and check out the API (there is a good overview in the topic discussion). Let me know if you like it or not. I'll probably add one more thing to it, which is an array print function for figuring out what is going on with ST's global arrays.
But that won't break compatibility with anything you download now.
I gotta run to work now. Have a good day!
Best,
DesertEagle
http://www.travisgood.com/X3/GlobalQ.zip
The topic discussion is here:
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=144118
It hasn't exactly lit the world on fire
Primarily they are for us. So... if you get a chance, download the file and check out the API (there is a good overview in the topic discussion). Let me know if you like it or not. I'll probably add one more thing to it, which is an array print function for figuring out what is going on with ST's global arrays.
But that won't break compatibility with anything you download now.
I gotta run to work now. Have a good day!
Best,
DesertEagle
Match Speed of Target:
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143740
Sector Takeover: http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143524
http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143740
Sector Takeover: http://forum2.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=143524
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russbo
- Posts: 862
- Joined: Sat, 12. Nov 05, 21:53
Of course the only two things in life that are certain are death and taxes, but I didn't think having it as part of my beloved universe would be something I'd want, lol. I understand the idea, but, isn't this adding a bit too much? As I've found so far, owning a sector is not a happy peaceful type of thing; there's lots of work, and lots of attacks and respawning stuff to deal with. Doesn't taxing your stations in other sectors kind of move you in the direction of wanting to put stations only in your sectors, which, by virtue of the fact that you've decimated them, kind of throws off the universe economy? I'm not sure. But, before, when I experimented with wiping out the Split sectors, I ended up with a not so happy economic situation.russbo, yes your stations will be taxed where ever they are, unless they are in a sector you own,
Just some thoughts, that's all.