Russia-Ukraine War

[Vertigo 7]

If Ukraine was using Western supplied Harpoon missiles to sink Russian ships, do you think they would admit that? Or would they say they used Ukrainian produced Neptune missiles? How would Russia respond if it were known that the missiles sinking their ships were Western supplied Harpoons?

Why not? They admitted to using Javelins to end that supposedly super awesome T-90 less than 2 weeks after it was deployed.

[JSDD]

https://www.politico.eu/article/pope-fr ... on-russia/

i believe that things are getting a bit too "messy" when we have to be "advised" what the truth is (or ought to be) ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disinform ... ance_Board
https://nypost.com/2022/05/02/bidens-di ... can-style/

and it makes me a bit uncomfortable that "homeland security" has control over such a board ^^
(i wonder what people would have said if george w bush had installed such a department in 2003)

Continuing the story of the "stolen" grain. Farmers from southern Ukraine SELL last year's harvest to Russia.
https://vesti-k.ru/news/2022/05/03/ferm ... o-v-krymu/

Word of warning to everyone. "Vesti" is not a real or independent news channel.

Y R U being sooo polite ?!
thats of course propaganda, who can imagine russia to pay ukraine for anything these days ?
i'd believe that if ukrainian media would have said the same thing, unfortunately thats not the case

maybe russsia thought they paid that stuff by sending some missiles into some buildings ^^

funny ... isnt it?

i just talked about "the US department of truth", and russian claims that they've bought (not stolen) ukrainian grain are just "propaganda"
the funny thing is that the german minister of agrar culture said that ukrainians have no option but to sell their grain to russians for little money ... so its apparently true ^^

[burger1]

May 7, 2022 Russian losses

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/sta ... 8393577472

Russia running out of tanks?

Russia might be blowing up bridges to slow Ukrainian counter offensive.

Azovstal metal plant still fighting. Most of the Russian military units left Mariupol to fight elsewhere.

Serna class landing craft destroyed near Snake Island.

Russia starting to show notable signs of falling in Ukraine? Lack of tanks, having to blow stuff up to prevent attacks, repositioning units, losing ground while Ukraine gains ground daily.

[Vertigo 7]

https://www.politico.eu/article/pope-fr ... on-russia/

i believe that things are getting a bit too "messy" when we have to be "advised" what the truth is (or ought to be) ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disinform ... ance_Board
https://nypost.com/2022/05/02/bidens-di ... can-style/

and it makes me a bit uncomfortable that "homeland security" has control over such a board ^^
(i wonder what people would have said if george w bush had installed such a department in 2003)

Maybe if Russia didn't lie all the time, paired with all the absurd shit Oompa Loompa lemmings spew, things like that wouldn't be necessary, would it? Besides, they're not controlling the press or blocking web access to anything, unlike Russia. But they're countering people like you with factual information.

You do see the difference, right? I can access any report I want, protest my government without fear of being arrested, I'm actually free to do that and more. Meanwhile, Russia arrests protestors for doing nothing more than holding up a blank piece of paper, shuts down broadcasts that dare to counter the Kremlin narrative, etc. How many Russian citizens have disappeared since February and will never be seen again? And I don't mean the dead soldiers in Ukraine that Russia refuses to retrieve.

Word of warning to everyone. "Vesti" is not a real or independent news channel.

Y R U being sooo polite ?!
thats of course propaganda, who can imagine russia to pay ukraine for anything these days ?
i'd believe that if ukrainian media would have said the same thing, unfortunately thats not the case

maybe russsia thought they paid that stuff by sending some missiles into some buildings ^^

funny ... isnt it?

i just talked about "the US department of truth", and russian claims that they've bought (not stolen) ukrainian grain are just "propaganda"
the funny thing is that the german minister of agrar culture said that ukrainians have no option but to sell their grain to russians for little money ... so its apparently true ^^

Why do you find human suffering funny? The hell is wrong with you?

[mr.WHO]

Serna class landing craft destroyed near Snake Island.

It's on a tape:
https://twitter.com/DefenceU/status/1522897994701549573

Seems like Ukraine is bombing Snake Island to their heart content

I think that in Russian minds, this island is essential for their marine landing operation to break to Transnistria, so this is a great killzone for Ukraine - given that Russia is very inflexible, they will constantly pump more equipment to Snake Island.
What is even more nice that is very close to US/NATO AWACS and recon drones, so Ukraine have nice, real time targeting data feed

[notaterran]

Russia running out of tanks?

Many of those things are mobile coffins. Behold the glorious T-72.

Has anyone seen footage of T-14s in Ukraine?

Newer Russian models have come out since the T-72, which was produced in the 1970s by the Soviet Union. One of them, the T-14 Armata, has been described as a sophisticated battlefield game-changer since it debuted at a 2015 military parade.

[JSDD]

Has anyone seen footage of T-14s in Ukraine?

Newer Russian models have come out since the T-72, which was produced in the 1970s by the Soviet Union. One of them, the T-14 Armata, has been described as a sophisticated battlefield game-changer since it debuted at a 2015 military parade.

nope, stats say not a single on has been destroyed ...
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/a ... pment.html

russians say first batch of these tanks gonna come this year (dunno whan exactly)
https://tass.com/defense/1262637?utm_so ... ipedia.org

apparently, ukrainian intelligence (GUR) claims that T-14 tank production stopped completely due to imported material shortage, ship production has stopped, too
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-704376

[Falcrack]

Some nice footage of 2 Ukrainian Su-27s bombing snake island. Apparently the Russians there are pretty helpless after TB2 took out their SAMs.

https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/15 ... ies-on-the

[mr.WHO]

russians say first batch of these tanks gonna come this year (dunno whan exactly)
https://tass.com/defense/1262637?utm_so ... ipedia.org

apparently, ukrainian intelligence (GUR) claims that T-14 tank production stopped completely due to imported material shortage, ship production has stopped, too
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-704376

If Russia plannd the release next year, then in "normal" circumstances they could already have stash of components for initial production run.
However, given that there is no such thing as "normal" cirmunstances in regards to Russia, I'm willing to believe that they are unable to start production due to sanctions (hell, they were saiyng that production will start next year, for several years already, before war and sanctions started).

Seems like T-14 and SU-57 are currently cursed with pernament pre-production stage.

Meanwhile F-22 is preparing for retirement, F-35 roll in droves from production line as order queue, Abrams get another upgrade pack and the Next-genfighter prototype aparently flew first test flight last year.

I think only Abrams and Bradley replacement programs are as cursed as T-14/SU-57, or even more as they barely get out of concept demonstrator stage.

Oh, lets not forget Russia first prototype stealth bomber (forgot the designation), that was suppose to be done along SU-57, but somehow dissapear, meanwhile B-2 also prepare for retirement and B-21 Raider production just started.

I don't even want to rub the wound deeper with China capable of outproduce Russia with cheap/disposable stuff (and A LOT MORE PEOPLE to crew them), while in the same time out-tech them with their advance stuff as well (e.g. stealh fighters, bombers, drones - albeit their power must be confirmed first, might be a propaganda/paper tech, just like the Russian stuff).

[V2200]

The defeat of the frigate Makarov is a fake, said the Ukrainian politician Arestovich.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hplh9DcWgsg

[burger1]

Stats for May 8, 2022

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/sta ... 27/photo/1

More than the one landing craft got destroyed at snake Island.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2 ... a48e84b3e9

[felter]

The defeat of the frigate Makarov is a fake, said the Ukrainian politician Arestovich.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hplh9DcWgsg

Yeah, it was another boat the Serna-class landing boat that was trying to unload a SAM system and/or SAM missiles onto Snake Island, quite possibly it was part of the frigate's ships fleet (though I'm just thinking that), it's a nice video of it going boom. It actually shows how stupid the Russians are as they keep trying to install SAM's onto Snake Island and the Ukrainians keep blowing them up, the Russians seem to be unable to learn from their experiences. This has also been followed up by 2 Ukrainian SU-27 visiting Snake Island and leaving some gifts for the Russians there, but I don't think they appreciated them.

[Tamina]

As a side note: None of the reputable news sites reported the Makarov incident.

BBC for example mentioned it like that:

[...]according to an unconfirmed report by a local website in Odesa.[...] Kremlin spokesman[...]told reporters: "No, we don't have such information." Western defence officials said they had not seen "anything at the moment" that confirms the frigate has been hit.

A few days later:
There is still no confirmation of Ukrainian claims on Thursday that a frigate called the Admiral Makarov was also hit.

German newspapers did not report it at all AFAIK.

It was yellow papers and social media. The latter of which does more propaganda for Ukraine than Ukraine themselves, sadly. Sometimes you get news days ahead before they got cross checked by the reputable news sites but most of the time they turn out to be fake. I fear that due to social media many people are exposed directly to information while being unable to critically question and cross check what they are reading. Especially when I see some people easily falling for Russian state propaganda.

[felter]

Both those videos I linked too were released by the Ukrainian government, the links I used were just because they were about the shortest available I have no idea about the channels they are on or even how reliable they are. The ship being sunk is mentioned somewhere on the BBC can't find it, I could give you a link to the Daily Mail story on it, but you mentioned reputable news sites. The other one was just released today, so a lot have not mentioned it, but here's the daily telegraph story on it, they're pretty much a reputable news site.

[Warenwolf]

Both those videos I linked too were released by the Ukrainian government, the links I used were just because they were about the shortest available I have no idea about the channels they are on or even how reliable they are. The ship being sunk is mentioned somewhere on the BBC can't find it, I could give you a link to the Daily Mail story on it, but you mentioned reputable news sites. The other one was just released today, so a lot have not mentioned it, but here's the daily telegraph story on it, they're pretty much a reputable news site.

I think that Tamina is commenting on alleged hit on a frigate sized ship by Ukrainian missile while what you are writing about is separate event (in "same" area, relatively speaking). So both are right?

[Tamina]

Yeah, I meant the Makarov story, sorry @felter should have made that clearer

[felter]

No worries, I had commented on that as well but as I said at the time there was a lot of Russian radio chatter at the time with the Makarov being mentioned, and I think that is why everyone was thinking it had been attacked and as I am now seeing it, it was probably that other ship that was attacked and the Makarov was just part of the rescue mission. It's got me thinking what ship is the Russian flagship right now, what with the Moskva being sunk and them not being able to add any more ships to the Black Sea it has to be one that was already there, does anyone know.

[V2200]

felter
I dare to correct. The flagship of the Russian Black Sea Fleet.
And why don't you tell us about the mediocre landing operation of Ukraine a day later?

add:
Ukrainian terrorists from Azovstal offered to exchange civilian hostages for foodstuff. 15 people per ton of foodstuff.

[Vertigo 7]

Amazing how bs like that appears shortly after Russia bombed yet another school killing at least 60 civilians. What a pitiful country Russia has become.

[Warenwolf]

add:
Ukrainian terrorists from Azovstal offered to exchange civilian hostages for foodstuff. 15 people per ton of foodstuff.

Yeah right . And I bet that glorious Russian army has not yet managed to storm a small industrial complex because it wants to spare civilian lives?

Kremlin propaganda is getting predictable.